Weapon efectiveness

[pht]

Hmm. I don't recall seeing that posted anywhere here...

I'd think it interesting to see that implemented though.

[Robgoblin]

Ammo exploding is something I am not sure about. Guess would be a way to balance ammo weapons over energy weapons as energy weapons affect the energy a Mech has more than ones that use ammo. I would think that in the future though that such an occurence happening would not be very likely. Just my opinion though.

[D3athsong]

I concur robb.  It would have to be a 1 in 10 or 1 in 20 chance.  Not quite sure how that could be done though.

[Cordrone]

I think it will happen but I also think there is a way of dealing with it. If you've got ammo that is propelled by a combustible fuel then there is always a chance it will get hit and explode. However, this is something that I'm sure a weapons system designer take into consideration when creating a mech, tank, plane or whatever. Weapons are not placed in external "pods" or "arms" just becuase it looks cool. When they take a hit you can have the arm or pod destroyed without lossing the whole mech. Mechs with ammo and weapons systems stored in the internal chassis of the mech will generally have very heavy armor in those areas to prevent such a problem or a damage control system (basically a small weak point in the armor to focus the resulting ammo blast and damage away from the crew and vital systems of the mech - usually located in the back of the mech) in place to deal with this.

It could also be a pilot option thing perhaps. Say a player chooses a mech with combustables located in the torso or center of the mech. As a matter of customization in the mech bay the pilot can choose an emergency system, at the expense of weight, that would prevent a great deal of damage or he/she can opt to risk it to add more armor, weapons, or a larger power plant for speed and energy. Just a thought. 

[Hamilton]

Ok, catching back up here.

When an Energy Drain Occurs, depending on the priorities set will determine what happens.  Again by default that will be the Energy Screens.  Sluggish movement could be added; but I think that will be considered an advanced feature to be added later.  Stalls and other forms of mishaps would be part of the Role-Playing aspects in which equipment and vehicles will have or suffer from quirks.


Ammunition:
- Cook-Off or Hot Guns:
I don't know about adding in that.  Although realistic, it might be something that people may not want to worry about.  A Hot Gun or Cook-Off in this sense is when the weapon is very hot and that the ammo will fire on its own, or the weapon keeps firing until it is out of ammo.

- Ammo Explosion from Direct Fire:
The chassis of all Mechs and vehicles are designed to release internal explosions through blow-out panels in the rear or top; much like the M-1 Abrams.  Minimal physical damage will occur (other than for the damage from the enemy weapon), but there will be some serious Shock Damage if the ammo was stored internally.  The safety devices of warheads are design in such a way that the warheads will not detonate properly.  Most of the explosion will be from fuel and propellant.
Missile Pods provide very poor protection to missiles from frontal attacks; while Missile Pylons provide no protection.  Missile Racks provide full armor protection to missiles.

- Ammo Explosion and Cook-Off from Internal Fires:
Assuming that the internal fire suppression failed to put out the internal fire, there will be a chance of the fire cooking-off the ammunition bin (if in the same location as the fire).  A random roll (undecided at this time) will determine if:
- Nothing happens this phase
- Ammunition is damaged (lost), but no explosion occured, just an increase of fire
- Ammunition explodes; as described above from Direct Fire
- Ammunition Cooks-Off; unlike an internal explosion, ammunition cook-off in this sense, means that the ammunition is firing and detonating internally.  This is basically going to result in catastrophic internal damage.  Note that certain forms of ammunition will never cook-off such as APDSFS (Armor Piercing Discarding Sabot Fin Stabilized; basically long metal darts).

Hitting the Ammo Bins is dependent on the size of the ammo bin compared to the rest of the internal components of the given section.

[Robgoblin]

Very interesting. I just thought that by that time in the future that it would be very unlikely to happen. Figure that would be one thing weapon companies would work hard at improving to get more buisness.

[Hamilton]

That is a valid point.
Perhaps saying that most forums propellant based ammunition uses a binary mixture that only becomes active when mixed.  That would mean that most AC shells would be liquid or jell based rather than power.  Missiles could be done the same way.

This would lower the chances of internal explosions.
I think I can go with that....

OR

That provides some differences with the levels of technology for missiles and Auto-Cannons.  Every level of technology has a lower chance of ammunition explosion due to safer compounds.  But of course a weapon can only use the same technology level ammunition it is designed for.

[Robgoblin]

That is a valid point.
Perhaps saying that most forums propellant based ammunition uses a binary mixture that only becomes active when mixed.  That would mean that most AC shells would be liquid or jell based rather than power.  Missiles could be done the same way.

This would lower the chances of internal explosions.
I think I can go with that....

OR

That provides some differences with the levels of technology for missiles and Auto-Cannons.  Every level of technology has a lower chance of ammunition explosion due to safer compounds.  But of course a weapon can only use the same technology level ammunition it is designed for.

I like that you would listen to what I say and can go with that thinking but I have to say that I like your idea for tech level even more. Makes things very different. Higher tech gives better options but those options include advantages and disadvantages. Using the highest technology would probably be the most expensive and hardest to repair. I could see the how needing higher level skills to work with (mechanic/tech part) such technology. What is cool is that higher tech level does not mean more powerful but could just mean lighter, more compact, less recoil, and lots of other things.

Glad to see the thoughts that are put forward. Makes me think more about all sorts of things and I like that.

[Cordrone]

That is a valid point.
Perhaps saying that most forums propellant based ammunition uses a binary mixture that only becomes active when mixed.  That would mean that most AC shells would be liquid or jell based rather than power.  Missiles could be done the same way.

This would lower the chances of internal explosions.
I think I can go with that....

This lowers the chances some but does not eliminate them. If the ammo is hit and the shells are damaged their is still a good chance the two elements are going to mix and thus fire off and start a chain reaction.

[D3athsong]

That is a valid point.
Perhaps saying that most forums propellant based ammunition uses a binary mixture that only becomes active when mixed.  That would mean that most AC shells would be liquid or jell based rather than power.  Missiles could be done the same way.

This would lower the chances of internal explosions.
I think I can go with that....

OR

That provides some differences with the levels of technology for missiles and Auto-Cannons.  Every level of technology has a lower chance of ammunition explosion due to safer compounds.  But of course a weapon can only use the same technology level ammunition it is designed for.

THe fact that you have looked at the idea andgivne it some thought is good enough for me.  It shows a strong commitment to your fanbase and that counts for alot thse days.  whatever is decided doesn't matter so much.  I can safely say that this will be the first game that requires a subscription to play that i will infact pay to play.

[Hamilton]

Thanks.

From what I know from past experience; users will know more about the system than the engineers.  This is the same for MMO's. 

[Red Baron]

Not sure if this is the right place to ask this, but since it was mentioned about power managment I thought I would ask.  Since there would be times that say weapons are powered down will that also help lower your signature of being detected?  For example if you have energy weapons that are "hot" they would theoretically show up better on say a thermal sensor.  It would cause you to be detected easier.  The person that is ready to go has the advantage of opening up on someone while the other person can sneak around a bit better, but would still have to power up to fight.

[Hamilton]

That is a problem I have with the rules.  Right now they are set so that energy weapons are always at full energy consumption, even when not being fired.  That of course doesn't seem right.  Energy weapons that are considered "hot" should have some energy consumption (such as to maintain energy bleeding from compacitors), but not at full.

[Red Baron]

That is a problem I have with the rules.  Right now they are set so that energy weapons are always at full energy consumption, even when not being fired.  That of course doesn't seem right.  Energy weapons that are considered "hot" should have some energy consumption (such as to maintain energy bleeding from compacitors), but not at full.

I like that idea.  Capacitors will need to be maintained to allow the weapon to be fired.  I am curious though.  If your weapon is always "hot" will that cause additional maintenance costs due to additional wear and tear?

[Hamilton]

I would say yes, but that is additional programming and another level of detail.  That will have low priority, but will be on the road-map. (It would be another reason why players would actually want to keep their weapon's offline, than to be online all of the time)